Nintendo is hardly a videogame company anymore

@ultra:
I wasn't trying to base a good game as the number of hours spent in the game. Surely, there are great games that don't require that much investment in time. A good game is measured by how much time you want to spend playing that game. Sure, there are games that don't take a lot of time and are good games, and there are absolutely horrible games that take up too much of your time. You can have a relatively short game, but you can spend a lot of time on it replaying it, going different routes than last time, doing a New Game+, whatever. A game is measured by how much time you would want to play it, not necessarily the length of the game itself. I expect a game to hook me in right as I start playing. It should be immersive. I shouldn't even have the thought of turning off the system in my head. And that's the problem with the casual games. They don't hook me in. They don't keep me glued to my seat (or feet if you are standing). They don't have the word addictive embedded into their gameplay.

Let me give you a good example of what I mean. Super Mario RPG is one of my favorite light-hearted RPGs. I used to play this when I was about 7 or 8. I've beaten this game from start to finish at least 20 times now, unlocking every little secret, getting 100 super jumps, uncovering every hidden treasure chest, etc. I've even done a low level game, with really only one rule, no grindfests. I think this game is great. I've obviously spent a lot of time on this game. If a game sucks, let's say for example Dirge of Cerberus. I didn't think this game was all that great. I only played through it once or twice. The relative time spent is much less than the other. If you are basing how great a game is on how it challenges the player, take a look at Ninja Gaiden, Castlevania, or other notorious games known to make you tear your hair out. If you make a game too hard, almost to the point of it being ridiculous, someone isn't going to sit there and play through the first level over, and over, and over until they finally get it. They'll simply turn off the console.

I still stand by my statement that the emerging new genre is online gaming. I've witnessed the ridiculous online matches between my friends online, some away at college, others not. The out of control online tournaments hosted within the dorms where the people you are playing against are across or down the hall from you. Yes, Co-op is great, but so is online. Left 4 Dead is a GREAT example of both. Gears of War sells great because you have really good graphics and a chainsaw that you can rip someone's flesh with. Put cartoony graphics, no blood, no chainsaw, but leave the multiplayer on. Is it a good game now?

The graphics on the Wii have potential. Look at Twilight Princess. Very good graphics, and it looks like they spent a lot of time on that. The other dime-a-dozen 2D cartoon drawings is what gets me. It's not that the Wii has horrible graphics output, it's the games that don't bother to approach the limit of the console. Conker's Bad Fur Day pretty much stretched the N64 to its limit with very beautiful graphics on a N64 title. You have the hardware, use it.

No one complains to Blizzard because IPs like Starcraft hasn't been reiterated over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. Starcraft has only had one expansion, and Starcraft 2. That's not overdoing it. And it doesn't matter if the IP is overused, as long as the game is an absolute gem, it doesn't really matter at that point. Diablo 3 is obviously the third installment, not the...I don't know 11th one. Let's see, we have Mario Bros., Super Mario Bros., Super Mario Bros 2, Super Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario World, Super Mario RPG, Super Mariokart, Super Mario 64, Mariokart 64, Mario Golf, Mario Tennis...and wow, I only mentioned the good ones and I'm only at the 64 era...Oh, and just to cut my list short, Mario Parties 1-8. Can you see why I'm sick of it?

The thing with Blizzard's IPs is that it isn't stale.

Metroid was based as a single player game but set in a FPS environment. Look at Warcraft. Warcraft was meant to be a multiplayer RTS but that's been set in an MMORPG setting, and it's the most popular game. Now why would Blizzard change its IPs after a great success like that? Would it have been as successful if Blizzard had sudden changed the IP and called it World of (insert new IP here)? Perhaps a change is worth the risk. Could you say that Crisis Core is horrible because it didn't stick true to its roots as a Turn-based RPG? It still does well with the Action element implemented into it.

Also, if the system is for "everyone" then it should include everyone. It should have a balanced number of games for every demographic. It shouldn't be this difficult for me to have to ask people on here what are some good games for the Wii, getting only 1 or 2 Mature-rated games, the rest are E or E+10.

The best analogy I can come up with is generality and specialty. If you go to a general store (I'll just say Meijer), they have everything, toys, games, groceries, clothes, bikes, auto maintenance, whatever. However, would you buy wrenches and tools or even clothes at meijer? No. You would go to a specialty store for that. You would go to a Sears or a craftmans shop to buy tools (or order the good sets online), a brand name store to buy clothes, and an auto-repair place to buy your stuff. I would even go so far as to say that you would go to a gamestop or something similar to buy games since the selection at meijer is extremely limited.
You can generalize like what Nintendo is doing, trying to aim at every demographic, but you'll miss on a lot of the important ones. Or you can specialize and aim at a specific demographic and be right on the money for what those fans want, while ignoring the others.

They half-assed natal. I'd rather not have it than it be half-assed and rushed.

 

While I dis-like the way nintendo is going, they have remained consistent (except for the seal of approval for changing to jsut mean -we approved it-nothing more) thru out the years...


Ultra's post seem to make alot of sence...


For you see-hardcore gaming isn't heathly-it's not what nintendo is aiming for-video games are actually meant for casuals...\



But here is the funny part-back during the ps1 and ps2 period-they had the most casuals XD



Soo many games aimed at everyone...



Nintendo tried too many strange things-and while the fans were happy-nintendo weren't-not with the lack of income



I say, as long as they MAKE 1 good game at least once a year, I'll be happy-the rest I get will ethier be rommed or bargin bins gems XD



Think about it-games made years ago were obviously not meant to be played hours on end, taking up people's lives...

THat's why I dragged myself of rpgs-my eye sight has already been shot trying to beat halo-pokemon-mario kart or metroid all at once (true-wanted them all beat at same time, I did it but...)


Now, as for the types of games, you can't have a game set for an "everyone" standard, one kid can do amazingly well in a wrestling game, while an adult will only do so well in such a game, thus wii sports or prehaps a puzzle game would suit...


Like as someone (forgot who???) said, it's a speciality...



Now that I seen nintendo come full circle, I see how it goes-games are meant to be played casually-not in long burst that take up your life (WoW-I'm looking at YOU)...


If you want an amazing game that everyone can play-admittedly I'd say wii sports-even though it's just a glorified tech demo, EVERYONE can play it, Golden eye-not everyone can...


As for the sale of rare-they hardly make games-they weren't even raking in the money-star fox adventures hardly made big sales even though it had players choice here in aus (pfft-the 64 had 1 million for re-release-with cube it became 50 thousand copies)...


Thus, everyone has a prefeance-and at the end of the day-a company will do what they can to make money-and target the chosen audience in the best way they can...



Lol, Metroid prime, awsome game, but while 3 sucked without multiplayer, it was for the best-probably bad feed back from the second (plus if it did-hunters would become obsolute).


And they only way for nintendo to stop making soo many of a dull series (mario party) STOP buying it!


Someone out there WILL buy it though, so it may not be any time soon....



Now just incase you got confused by what I said-just keep in mind this...




In order to satifiy the hardcores, they will need to sacrifice profits, if they sacrifice the hardcores, they will generate more money than what they can from a hardcore game...thus preserving a companies future.



(that's how EA and THQ are still going despite poor quality )

 

I think the only thing Nintendo are doing these days is manufacturing games that are ADDICTIVE over quality.

they see that people love these games so they re-release them so people keep buying. they need to make sumit new

i think comp games are the same these days.. theyre just gettin better graphics (and thats only marginally better)

 

Some do come out well...



But for pc games-agreed XD

 

there are many kids games on the wii is because of the family image. the system is meant for everyone and the family image is a good representation for "everyone". now when a developer sees this image of a family, they don't think of creating a game for everyone but for kids. why is that i don't know.

it's hard to complain about blizzards ip and compare them to nintendo. the reason, nintendo has a console they need to sell and it's the reason why they have many mario games in the field. i don't know why [and many others as well] nintendo used mario as a selling spokesman....to be continue

i'll be back on friday, possibly to post more.

 

These kiddie games still don't appeal to the 18-25 demographic though. These games appeal to 12 year olds, 3 year olds, 8 year olds, but there are very few that appeal to 18-25 year olds. Nintendo reaches out to the older crowd, 35+ with galaga, another remade tetris game, puzzle oriented games, but really ignores an important age range. It is uncommon to find anyone 35 and up that plays videogames simply because there wasn't much exposure to videogames when they grew up.

So your "majority" here is basically anyone too young to have a credit card and is leeching off their parent's credit card...at least for WiiWare...apparently 6 year olds play GTA. I played Mortal Kombat back in the day when I was 6, when that was the most violent game of its time...

I said earlier that these WiiWare games may have gotten great reviews, but it does absolutely no good if the game does not appeal to a certain type of person. You could have the absolute perfect game but if it doesn't appeal to the right group and sales are low, then what good is it? I don't see a typical 21 year old buying Lost Winds, World of Goo, Neves, or Swords & Soldiers, no matter how good of an RTS it is. I see normal 21 year olds, (or anyone in that bracket) buying GTA 4, Gears of War 2, God of War 2, Forza 2, GT5, Fable 2, Army of Two, Halo 3, MGS 4, SF 4, Soul Calibur 4, Call of Duty 4, 5 etc. Lot's and lot's of 4s...and 2s. I haven't even mentioned the Guitar Heroes or Rock Bands.

The problem with today is that you can release a shit game, and if it appeals to little kids, chances are, you'll profit from that. It doesn't even have to be a good game. Most parents don't go onto a rom site and look at user comments (however useless they may be), or go onto a review site and do extensive research to see if it's a good game for their kids. They just go to a store, see that the box art is "nice" and there ya go, you have yourself a sale. Why is shovelware such a big problem now when it wasn't back in the SNES-N64 era? Why is Nintendo blamed as the breeding grounds for shovelware? Hell, I never even heard of the term shovelware until the Wii came out with its endless stock of games.

My friend's girlfriend bought him an Xbox 360, two controllers, and some accessories, with one stipulation. The only game they bought with it was Viva Pinata. He immediately calls me up to ask if he could borrow Halo 3, COD4, and he was like, "dude, I need some of 'our' type games. I can't stand this crap." Sadly, I had to tell him that I don't have a 360...

And we're back to the hardcore abandoning nintendo vs. nintendo abandoning the hardcore. Not hardcore persay, more like mature audience. Nintendo did great with the N64, that audience (I was 7 when it first came out) led them to success. When the gamecube came out (basically 2002), that audience progressed but Nintendo didn't keep with that audience. They kept static to the 7-12 bracket, while the low end of the spectrum of that audience is now 12-13ish, the median being 14-15ish, the end being 16-17ish. So yes, Nintendo "abandoned the hardcore" or the evolving age group, only to be picked up by Microsoft and Sony. The older audience sees that the gamecube is a bust, and abandons Nintendo. Nintendo sees that the older end of the spectrum is gone, and now finds a niche with the younger crowd, instead of trying to win back their former audience.

Perhaps I should clarify on the cartoon issue. It's not just solely the cartoon style that gets to me as well as many other people, but moreso on what the cartoons represent. Castle Crashers is a great game with a cartoon style, but the game isn't embedded with kiddie themes. It represents newgrounds, which, last I checked, is a site that caters to the more mature audience. Personally, I think Kingdom Hearts would have done even better if Disney wasn't there to incorporate the Disney themes. I love South Park because of its mature themes, the cartoon aspect has nothing to do with it.

I try not to compare multiplatform games from console to console, because there is no point when the other two companies dominate with superior versions, but when I can get these games for free instead of shelling out $50, I'm obviously taking the free route even if the games are inferior on the Wii. Something is better than nothing.

PC online gaming is obviously well established, but with the new technology, and creation of very resource demanding games, one cannot simply keep up with upgrading their computers every time a new game comes out. For people like me, who don't have a gaming MONSTER, an Xbox 360 with Live will have to suffice. Microsoft is smart on both sides of the spectrum, either with PC sales (OS wise) or Live subscriptions. They're smart enough to make Live their strongpoint and unrivaled.

And last I checked, the "uber nerd" that lives in his basement playing games all day is part of a family. The 24 year old sibling that you've been wanting to get to move out of the house for the last 5 years is still part of a family. And as soon as they move out, chances are, they're making a family of their own...at least, that's what your parents have been hoping for...
Evidently, family incorporates everyone. So a family image would be an incorrect label. More like "kid friendly" if it is to simply single out the mature audience.

 

I'm going to keep this very clear.

Appealing to a demographic doesn't make something a good game. One person's opinion doesn't make something a good game. Being good makes a good game. It's irrelevant what themes are presented if the game is good.

And South Park is funny because it's a satire. It's meant to be funny, the "mature" themes shouldn't matter to you unless you are twelve years old and find toilet humor funny.

 

I still think getting a shuriken stuck in your eye is damn hilarious...
Can you imagine Disney doing a satirical comedy? Oh yeah..that's right they did, but they immediately let them go to preserve their "kid friendly" image.

You can't have one condition without meeting the other. It has to appeal to the demographic AND be a good game to be a good game. If it doesn't appeal, then you get hidden gems, which make the most of their money in the bargain bins, not at release. These usually end up on the mostly-biased best of all time games for 2XXX for X system.

Cooking Mama is a "good" game but would you play it? Would you buy it? Would you play Nintendogs? Would you play the Imagine series and be totally hooked? And lastly, would you be caught dead playing these games with your friends?

It's not that I'm totally anti-kid friendly games. You know that I play Pokemon, a game obviously directed at young kids. You know that I've played just about every Mario game in existence. I've played Animal Crossing and enjoyed it. I just need more of the other spectrum.
Again, I have a handful of games, not a plethora. I don't get that same feeling of going into a Gamestop and being overwhelmed by all of the choices like you would at a Baskin Robbins. Instead, I get a handful of games. I go in there from time to time to ask them what are the hot games right now, even though, I obviously, don't buy them. I've fallen victim of buying a game, playing it until the hype goes down and then never play it again. All of these posts here have the same underlying idea, don't fall victim to buying something that you're never ever going to play again.

 

Stopped read there-they didn't make galaga!!!


Nintendo is an old gaming company, but it's ideal consumer is the "family" and thus spreads out the range...


It's not JUST 6 year olds, like you said, teens/young adults...


In australia, it is the PERFECT gaming console-many parents bought it so they can join in the fun-many kids play these-and unlike other bigger countries, it isn't a tech haven, no, sporting nuts, clubbers and the more common "causual' gamers are the ones who make sales...



Plus it far cheaper to buy games for-LOOK AT THE DIFFERANCE BETWEEN IT AND THE COMPITITION!


They aren't a hardcore gaming company-so what-they were never meant to be-they just happen to stumble across a few classics during thier R+D and put them into the fray...


You can't have everything-but if you want a hardcore collection of games, buy every console, and there you go-sure the wii shall have a lack compared to the other's...but that is the way the cookie crumbles...



OH-I forgot the mention-here is aus, most of the gamers have a short attention span-not many are like me wanting retro-hardcore stuff...



Sad but true-this is what happens when you visit your local eb games constantly and watch what everyone is buying-and helping them (I am not letting some brat get GTA just because his mum doesn't know how to read warning labels!).

 

They have it in the VC section, either that, or I have an injected wad of the game.
They also have a bunch of Sega games and whatnot in the VC section, even if they're not making those games, they're selling them through a Nintendo product. My favorite one is Gunstar Heroes.
I don't actually go on the Wii Shop Channel. I'm very cautious about going on "official things" like firmware, shop channels, and anything that collects data. Just a precaution really. They really can't do anything about it.

I still don't see the value of a $50 game, even for a Wii title. The PS3 usually has the highest prices, but that's also a Blu-Ray disc, with well over twice the amount of data on it. Soul Calibur IV cost me about $60ish (I think) when I bought it for the PS3 and to my disappointment, I haven't touched it since the first week of playing it. It is a good game, it just doesn't have the replay value I was expecting. Too much hype with the whole Star Wars thing, although some are against that, saying that they were out of place. Then again, so was Link in Soul Calibur II, but that was one of the best selling points of that game.

Most Wii games are only 4.7 GB, which is perfect for putting on single layer DVDs.
If only I could scrub and multiboot a few Wii games onto a dual layer DVD...

I...just...got...an idea. I wonder how many scrubbed gamecube games can fit onto a dual layer DVD...

While looking up on how to boot Linux onto my PS3, I read that someone ripped Madden and it was close to 20 something GB. That's a lot of data for one game.

Here in the US, most parents over the age of 40 can't even operate a computer and do simple tasks like check email, run a defrag, disable all of the useless startup programs, etc. I don't expect them to be amazing at videogames, or even remotely interested in them.

I was looking at a lot of the WiiWare on the actual WiiWare section of their website and a really good score is 7.0 (relative). That's like getting a C-. I don't know about you, but an 8.0 is the threshold between a fair game, and a good one. Not many hit the 8 mark, even fewer hit the 8.5 and maybe one has a 9. something. It was either FFIV TAY or World of Goo, not sure.

So, like we were saying before, you gotta have a good game to make it a good game. Most of them fall short.

At least the NDS is doing rather well with the release of some pretty good RPGs lately.

 

...I have nothing to argue with your point...


But for galaga-it's namco if I remember-it's a mixed list on VC-even sonic is there...


And I would agree to hiding your self when online XD I do the same on psn...not that it works for me anymore...they blocked out m33 firmware


(by not make I thought you were reffering that game to a nintendo product-sorry for the confusion )

But that is true, about gotta be good to play it-but how do you think kids become adults and thus become good?


Plus the advantage to the wii-family friendly-they have all these pointless guides (if they asked me I could have done it for them )...


Good games are hard to find-but games that everyone can play seemed alot harder to find until the wii showed up-am I correct?



Or did the annoying ps2/ps3 do so before?



Now that I think about it, ps2 did do it, sing star, etc...



But with the ps3, it's become harder...


...I have nothing else to add.

 

demographics and categorization of the player is a bad and very awful action taken by developer today.

you see a lot of this on every game made by third parties for every console. you clearly see it in 360/ps3 as the games for those two consoles are male eccentric due to the violence, gore and sex that is often focused most by game developers. if a casual game were released for the 360/ps3, you'll notice that the game is designed with many preconceived notion and generalization of what casual gamers would want to play. this is awful because the developers are saying you're playing these casual games because you're too dumb to play a "real" game.

when you play a 360/ps3 games, even wii games, there are great games made by great developers that are very dedicated into making great games. but then again the developers put into them a lot of ideas and concepts that they want you, as the player, to swallow. what they make you swallow is what they believe is gaming, their ideas of what is what. game review sites such as ign and gamespot help to reinforce these ideas. look at the review of xmen origins wolverine the movie video game on ign. the guy implies that a good game only comes with good and great graphics, hence the reason why the 360/ps3 got a higher score as opposed to the wii.

a lot of the current developers have this problem with demographics. how did this happen is unknown because there aren't that many historians that have done research on such topics for video games. i believe it happened during mid ps1 and afterwards. many of the ps2 games are demographics or categorizations. the one way of knowing is by asking if both old [maybe more like mid] and young and if both boys and girls are wanting to play the games. if none of them then there is a demographics and categorization, which means generalization and stereotyping.

a good example of non demographics and categorization game is probably guitar hero and rock band. the reason why is because not only do girls would like to pretend to be a rocker or a rocker band but also boys and not only do old people would like to relive the idea of being young and pretending to be a rocker or having a group band but also young people. the high sales of these games means it's a game meant for everyone. you've seen those youtube videos of grannies playing guitar hero and rock band. it means they would like to pretend they were one of those classic girl band from the past. a girl from the 80's may play guitar hero and rock band pretending to be the misfits band or something.

in the end, demographics and categorization is bad. it's the developers sticking the middle finger to you and putting it in your butt.

a question to think and consider.
"...Here in the US, most parents over the age of 40 can't even operate a computer and do simple tasks like check email, run a defrag, disable all of the useless startup programs, etc. I don't expect them to be amazing at videogames, or even remotely interested in them...." insanecrazy07

how did atari created gamers and players in video games if such a thing as video games didn't exist?

have you let your parents play super mario brothers 1?

 

I agree that demographics are bad. I agree, because the people who do the "research" and statistics do a pretty bad job of it.

Guitar Hero and Rock Band are a unique case because the way the game works is that it appeals to almost everyone simply by including a very broad range of songs of all types of rock. You have songs from the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, and newer songs as well. With DLC songs, the game can expand infinitely. Even Still Alive by GlaDOS appeals to the Half-Life fans that have played Portal. Even if you don't like rock, playing guitar, bass, drums and singing along with your friends is where the fun is at, and you might just appreciate the music like I did.

The reason why I don't mention Guitar Hero and Rock Band much when it comes to Nintendo is that they're multiplatform games that are outdone by Microsoft and Sony. The Wii versions have less content, and inferior graphics (not like it matters too much). The less content may be small things like the store where you buy guitars and outfits, or the bigger stuff like an entire set of songs.

Nintendo always gets the short end of the stick when it comes to multiplatform games. I tend to stick to the platformers only, but sadly, the platformers are usually shovelware or Mario IPs. The N64 shined in its day because there were so many platformers and so few multiplatformers.

Yes, I have let my parents play SMB, they suck. They're the Pac-Man, Galaga, Space Invaders, Pong type people.

 

guitar hero and rock band is a good example of where graphics doesn't matter. when people play these two games, they are not playing for the visual quality as like an fps game but rather the pretending of being a guitarist or rock band group.

you're parents were the original gamers [those who played on the atari]? did you know that at one time they experienced what nintendo did to them back in the 80's with the release of the dpad as what nintendo is doing now to the hardcore. your parents at one time thought nintendo was going to kill video games [due to the dpad] just as how the hardcore believe nintendo is going to kill video games or rather make video games stupider with making casual games. do your parents prefer the wii more then the other systems [360/ps3]?

jem [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jem_(TV_series)] is one example why some older generation of people like guitar hero and rock band. guitar hero and rock band makes them pretend they were one of those popular jem characters. btw, hasbro could have made tons of money on this from little girls [as well as the previous generation of jem fans] if they had remade the series.

 

Basically, if you are getting sick of the "kiddie-graphics", then choose another system to play on.

 

...just saying something about nintendo...


back in the 64 period, they kinda suffered because of the lack of multiplatform games...the games it did were great in ost cases, but sales suffered because of that...


With the gamecube-the only reason why they had the sales it did make was because of a few factors...


A.Most of the players were hard core entusist supporting it and nothing else

B.The other's had other consoles to keep them at bay

C.They were dumb and bought it, and later sold it for a crap amount of cash (ps2's are selling for $99, where's the cube is $40 second hand, xbox is about $70 last time I checked-and what they got when selling them would be less than half)...


With the wii, like the cube, but unlike the 64, they got the balance right, it lacked sheer power (cube was second in it's gen) but had a great multiplatform game range.



Although it's the reason I moved from a hardcore follower to just a rommer (once I got bored of the wii, I got my acekard XD), it was a great move for nintendo...


Prehaps, when everyone else goes-or nintendo becomes the next mirco$oft-they will create more hardcore game-or make horrible cash ins, depending on how they go...


I just want to see what they do next gen-will they go for sheer power and range while keeping it cheap-or will they upgrade only a little (say 360 power) while keeping game range high to have a wide audience...


It will be interesting to watch that's for sure

 

a lot of games on the wii are very demographics. this is the reason why the games on the wii are the way they are because the developers are putting assumptions on the people who own and play the wii. i don't know why these developers would do such a thing. this is the reason why i call them stupid and lazy. they are not only putting bad effort on the wii they are also doing it on the 360/ps3. you may not notice it due to distractions but they are there.

nintendo is the one company that is very dedicated to their customers. in one of their iwata asks question on the motion plus, there was a moment where they were composing an idea of having the user read the manual to understand on how to installing the peripheral. they scrapped the idea and tried to make things simpler [this explains the video demonstration]. the idea was that most [or rather all] people won't bother reading the manual and will just go straight to the product itself and try to tinker with it. like when you buy a game, you don't read the manual you go straight into the action.

 

The 'other' companies would just use surveys, PLUS most of the games are aimed at thier target audiences...


But in a way, I think nintendo is helping "too" much, the wii new mario bros has a feature where it can beat a level for you, get lazy and you can most of the game this way...


That's another aspect I hate about nintendo now-idiot proofing of thier games

 

WHAT?
ugh that is the STUPIDEST thing I have ever heard -.-
the main point of playing games used to be that you'd suck at the begining, but get better over time and the difficulty ramps up accordingly, good games always pushed the difficulty just that little bit higher then you were up to, making the levels fun and engaging.
I have nothing more to say, THIS is why I play MMORPGs more now.

I have, swords and soldiers is awesome XD
if you read the text carefully you'll actually find a lot of hidden adult jokes, you just have to put 3 and 3 together.

0.o have you BEEN to newgrounds?
It's full of 10 year olds, id say only 5% of the site is anywhere NEAR mature.

 

I hate that the computer is a cheating bastard most notably in Nintendo games.

Looking past the cartoony feel, like with the FPS argument, an RTS can't be played the same as if it were with a mouse and keyboard. Everything is too slow and you lack the mass grouping hotkeys. Ever know what it's like to group 380 zerglings and send them all to their death? Can you do that without hotkeys? No. You'll end up selecting the same zergling more than once.

Yes, I'm on it everyday. However, I don't check the comments of its users, but its material. It's obvious that you'll find a bunch of 10 year olds in the adult section because well, there's nothing barring them from it.